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Poll: Ban Smoking at State Parks?

What do you think about plans to ban smoking at Pennsylvania state parks?

 

A trial ban on smoking will be imposed at two Pennsylvania state parks next year in response to complaints about litter.

The Department of Conservation and Natural Resources says park visitors are complaining about cigarette butts discarded in lakes and on beaches. Maintenance workers end up spending a lot of time collecting butts, especially ones from filtered cigarettes which take longer to biodegrade.

Officials have not said yet which of the state's 120 parks will have the experimental smoking ban.

What do you think? Vote in our poll and add your comments below.

  • What do you think about plans to ban smoking at Pennsylvania state parks?

    (Voting has been closed for this question)
    • Banning smoking at Pennsylvania's state parks is a great idea.
        32 (76%)
    • The plan to ban smoking at state parks stinks.
        9 (21%)
    • It doesn't matter to me one way or the other.
        1 (2%)
    Total votes: 42
  • Your vote will only count once. This is not a scientific poll. View Results Vote!
Related Topics: Department of Conservation and Natural Resources, Smoking Ban, State Parks, and cigarette butts

Ann Edwards

8:26 am on Monday, July 16, 2012

Maybe if there were receptables available to dispose of the butts, there would be less to clean up!

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Heather Depew

9:20 am on Monday, July 16, 2012

I'm tired of seeing cigarette butts everywhere. I bring my dog, and if she poops on the trail nowhere near a garbage can, I carry the poop in a bag UNTIL I get to one. I think it's much easier for a smoker to do the same thing but for their cigarette butts. When I see cigarette butts laying around the park on the trails I just think of lazy, ignorant Americans. Please carry around a ziplock bag and put your butts in there until you come to a garbage can. It's not that hard. But if people are too dumb or lazy to do this, then, smoking should be banned. Smokers have only brought it on themselves. Also, I see a lot of other dog poop on the trail, and that makes me mad. If other dog owners don't start cleaning up after their dogs, then the state parks will ban dogs. SO PLEASE don't be ignorant. CLEAN UP AFTER YOUR DOG. Even if you have to carry it in a bag for awhile. This is called responsibility.

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john davidson

9:59 am on Monday, July 16, 2012

Another Anti-Smoking Hoax Debunked. Those cigarette filters are 100% biodegradable.

The cigarette butt menace was created to support outdoor smoking bans because many non-smokers will accept that secondhand smoke is not harmful in an outdoor setting.

The anti-smoking zealots admit that the tobacco and paper in cigarette butts are biodegradable, but claim that the cellulose acetate cigarette filters are a plastic, like styrofoam and polystyrene, and will contaminate the earth forever. This is not true. Cellulose acetate is a wood product. It is completely degradable through biological, chemical, and photo chemical degradation mechanisms.

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john davidson

10:00 am on Monday, July 16, 2012

Sorry, I don't have a nice, easy to read MSM news article to give you. I have research papers from cellulose acetate manufacturers. Ann W., a commentor to a Dick Puddlecote article, put me onto this. http://dickpuddlecote.blogspot.com/2011 ... found.html

http://www.acetateweb.com/pdf/Environme ... ilters.pdf
"STUDY OF THE ENVIRONMENTAL DEGRADATION OF CIGARETTE FILTERS: A simulation of the Roadside or Parking Lot Environment." Stephen K. Haynes, et al,\., Research Laboratories, Eastman Chemical Company, Kingsport Tenn.

"In recent years there has been increasing public awareness of items which may be discarded as litter with particular attention being given to cigarette filters. Some studies have concluded that when cigarette filters are introduced into the environment, they either do not degrade or degrade very slowly. Previous work in our laboratories has demonstrated that cigarette filters biodegrade readily in environments where mixed microbial populations can thrive. The purpose of this study was to examine the changes occurring in cigarette filters over time in an environment similar to that of a parking lot or roadside area. In this environment, exposure to sunlight, moisture and wind occur, but there is limited exposure to microbial attack ... "

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john davidson

10:00 am on Monday, July 16, 2012

"CONCLUSIONS: Previous work has demonstrated that cigarette filters biodegrade readily in environments where mixed microbial populations can thrive. This work demonstrates that current commercial cigarette filters also degrade when exposed to an environment which is not optimal for microbial biodegradation."

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john davidson

10:01 am on Monday, July 16, 2012

Another Anti-Tobacco Hoax Debunked. Those cigarette filters are 100% biodegradable.

The cigarette butt menace was created to support outdoor smoking bans because many non-smokers will accept that secondhand smoke is not harmful in an outdoor setting.

The anti-smoking zealots admit that the tobacco and paper in cigarette butts are biodegradable, but claim that the cellulose acetate cigarette filters are a plastic, like styrofoam and polystyrene, and will contaminate the earth forever. This is not true. Cellulose acetate is a wood product. It is completely degradable through biological, chemical, and photo chemical degradation mechanisms.

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Arthur

10:05 am on Monday, July 16, 2012

It is not just cigarette butts. Why should I, as a non-smoker, have to smell the foul odor of cigarette smoke? I know that many smokers say I should move away from them and that they have rights. BUT, I also have the right to smell non-polluted air.
If they want to smoke, do it in their own private space where they don't bother anyone else.

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Mary Anne Looby

7:23 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Arthur, I agree that you have the right to non polluted air. However a State park is a big place and if you are bothered by it you should move. I am not a smoker, but it is getting nuts the way it is being banned when we have so much polution in our air from industry.

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tamarya

10:50 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

I do not like going to stores getting coughed and sneezed on by other lazy customers that are too lazy to cover their mouths, so can we ban disgusting people from the public too? It is pretty bad more germs float around a store than they do in a school.

brian

12:06 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

I am amazed at the amount of people that think it is okay for the state to discriminate against a certain group of people. Would it be okay for the state to ban people of color at state parks too?
I have never smoked in my life. I can't stand the smell of cigarette smoke. When I visit relatives that smoke, I have to shower and change when I get home to get the vile smell off of me. I do ban smoking in my home, because it is my home and I can do whatever I want. It comes down to property rights.
If a restaurant or bar wants to allow or ban smoking in their establishment, that is up to them. It is their business and they should be able to run it as they see fit.
The state should not be able to discriminate against a group of people for using a legal substance from which they get tax revenues. Both smokers and non-smokers own the state parks.
I despise smokers that throw their butts on the ground or out of their cars. There used to be a PA hotline number that you could call to report the license plates of litterers. The state shut it down because "all they calls they received were about smokers and not people throwing garbage out their windows" thereby lessening the stigma of cigarette butts as litter.
Banning smoking is not the way to go forward. Strict enforcement and heavy fines for littering are. When smokers are being fined $500 for throwing their butts on the ground, they will stop, or pay.
Better yet, 100 hours of community service, cleaning up cigarette butts.

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Common Sense

5:26 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Lets nit make this matter of responsibility a racial matter. The state is protecting the majority of citizens who want a cleaner place, nothing wrong with that.

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john davidson

6:31 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Actually JIM CROWE laws were left intact after the 14th amendment was ratified and its why smoking ban laws are still legal even though they too like Jim Crowe segregate and ban people from society. Its a simple part of the equal protection clause, ie due process, many if youve got the votes you can do anything regardless of what protections you thought existed anywhere!

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Mary Anne Looby

7:25 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Excellent idea Brian! I agree with you completly.

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tamarya

10:53 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

So you saying when you leave the park Common Sense, you do not get into your vehicle and drive away, because if I am not mistaken a car has an exhaust that does not exactly produce water into the air.

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captrick56

2:38 pm on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

Tamarya,
Actually, car exhaust (as any internal combustion engines) does produce water into the air at the rate of 1 gal of water produced for each gal of gasoline burned. Don't believe it? Watch any car exhaust on a cool morning and there's a puddle under the exhaust pipe. Watch a car pull away from a stop light and sometimes it just pours out of the exhaust pipe. It also collects in the oil pan as combustion blow by gets past the rings and into the oil and the water condenses.
During the war, the Germans used to condense, collect and store the water from the exhaust of their Zeppelins to maintain the weight and balance of the aircraft so they wouldn't have to vent gas to maintain neutral buoyancy.
Just thought you'd be interested. Any more brilliant observations on your part?

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tamarya

5:34 pm on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

Yeah I know water is mixed captrick56, however it is not all water if it was nothing but water coming out your exhaust you could start your vehicle in an enclosed garage and remain in there for a long period and nothing would happen. However truthfully something will happen, my uncle lost hs brother because he did that.

Heather Depew

12:30 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Again, stop littering your butts and to the dog owners, clean up after your dog. If everyone did this and carried around a bag in their pocket to dispose of the items, our parks would be cleaner. Maybe at the start of all trail heads at these state parks, the park service can provide baggies by a garbage can. This might make more people use the system I described and then EVERYONE can enjoy the park.

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Ron Beitler

1:17 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

As long as butts don't hit the ground and immediately disappear its littering. I don't care of they are biodegradable. Orange peels are biodegradeable I can't walk around throwing them on sidewalks.

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john davidson

6:35 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Sure you can toss peelings around or even broken glass. Its why we have litter laws,simply enforce the laws already on the books no need for bans at all wouldnt you agree!

Carrie Havranek

2:16 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

I do not like getting out of my car, or walking to my car, and smelling cigarette smoke with my kids after an afternoon in the great outdoors, inhaling fresh air and getting exercise. This just happened yesterday with us at Jacobsburg; someone was smoking before getting ready to walk the dog in the woods. These places should be preserved and kept as pristine as possible. I consider cigarette smoke an infringement on that environment--notwithstanding all the conversation (needed and important) about whether or not the butts are biodegradable. Sorry, smokers.

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tamarya

11:00 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Do not drive your car if you want pristine air, get on your 2 feet and make your kids use theirs and you will also help the environment, do not knock others when you just admitted in your comment you contribute to air pollution.

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tamarya

11:02 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Oh yeah and John'd comment made me think of something, so you mean you were one of the nice peaceful people on the 4th not using fireworks for your children? Because if you were using them, those make the air alot more filthier than a cigarette.

Common Sense

5:20 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Most people go to parks for a nice walk, fresh air, and relax with family. It all gets ruined by one inconsiderate smoker who doesn't care about the air you breath or which direction the wind is blowing and the fumes permeate a huge area. I agree the butts are out of control, consider the source of someone who doesn't take care of themselves, why should they care about the rest of us. The very sad truth . . .

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john davidson

5:40 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Its really sad to see people that would be for something so insane to start with as a outdoor smoking ban. Even the indoor bans are rediculous and based upon JUNK SCIENCE!

If your going to ban cig smoke inside or out your going to have to ban RESTARAUNT SMOKE,AUTO EMISSIONS,BAR-B-QUES,FIREWORKS..........youd even have to outlaw your own breathing as even your breath contains chemicals simular to that of cig smoke naturally! Yes its just that stupid! Emissions of naturally occuring chemicals are in everything,the natural air/clean air is made up of the same broken down natural chemicals as even tobacco smoke when its burned...........There never was any harm from second hand smoke.........They literally made it all up!

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john davidson

5:40 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

If you’re afraid of second-hand smoke, you should also avoid cars, restaurants…and don’t even think of barbecuing.

here are just some of the chemicals present in tobacco smoke and what else contains them:

Arsenic, Benzine, Formaldehyde.

Arsenic- 8 glasses of water = 200 cigarettes worth of arsenic

Benzine- Grilling of one burger = 250 cigarettes

Formaldehyde – cooking a vegetarian meal = 100 cigarettes

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john davidson

5:40 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

When you drink your 8 glasses of tap water (64 ounces) a day, you're safely drinking up to 18,000 ng of arsenic by government safety standards of 10 nanograms/gram (10 ng/gm = 18,000ng/64oz) for daily consumption.

Am I "poisoning" you with the arsenic from my cigarette smoke? Actually, with the average cigarette putting out 32 ng of arsenic into the air which is then diluted by normal room ventilation for an individual exposure of .032 ng/hour, you would have to hang out in a smoky bar for literally 660,000 hours every day (yeah, a bit hard, right?) to get the same dose of arsenic that the government tells you is safe to drink.

So you can see why claims that smokers are "poisoning" people are simply silly.

You can stay at home all day long if you don’t want all those “deadly” chemicals around you, but in fact, those alleged 4000-7000 theorized chemicals in cigarettes are present in many foods, paints etc. in much larger quantities. And as they are present in cigarettes in very small doses, they are harmless. Sorry, no matter how much you like the notion of harmful ETS, it’s a myth.

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Common Sense

5:52 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

You are putting just way to much thought and energy into justifying killing yourself with cigarettes. I bet you are smoking while making this story. I drink filtered water which is far far cleaner than the TAR you are coating your lungs with that will eventually take your life. You have the will to quit, and I know as an X smoker it is hard, but you will hate cigarettes as much as I do once you succeed. Good luck, live long and prosper.

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john davidson

6:27 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Actually the longest lived people on earth were smokers!

Not 1 Death or Sickness Etiologically Assigned to Tobacco. All the diseases attributed to smoking are also present in non smokers. It means, in other words, that they are multifactorial, that is, the result of the interaction of tens, hundreds, sometimes thousands of factors, either known or suspected contributors - of which smoking can be one.

Zach Lindsey

8:21 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

I'm a pretty big hippie. I pick up cigarette butts along the trail when I'm walking. I also pick up wrappers to granola bars, empty bottles of Gatorade ... I even picked up a McDonalds bag once. Should we ban all these things from parks as well? Because, honestly, even if Mr. Davidson is wrong (and I doubt he is), a Gatorade bottle is a hell of a lot worse. Maybe the parks could just attempt to educate users a little better.

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D. Wag

8:44 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Smokers should eat their butts...you guys like the taste so much...have some more!!

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john davidson

9:48 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Passive Aggressive Personality Disorder | Peace and Healingwww.peaceandhealing.com/psychology/.../passive-aggressive/Cached
You +1'd this publicly. Undo
What is the treatment of Passive Aggressive Personality Disorder? ... One of the goals of therapy is to try to promote self-confidence in these individuals by ...

Acting out is frequent in terms of verbal assaults and then rationalized away that it was out of humor or “just a joke.” In reality the intent was clear harm and possible humiliation of another party.These individuals have extreme difficulty with confrontation, and do not no do well with their behavior being pointed out. This cycle is repetitive and part of this reason is due to the fact they find someone to fill their need for sympathy. Some of these characteristics are also found in individuals with borderline personality disorder, as well as antisocial and avoidant personality disorders.

http://www.peaceandhealing.com/psychology/personality-disorders/passive-aggressive/

Melissa Garland

9:23 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

When I go to a state park to enjoy the fresh air and outdoorts, it is ruined by smelling other people's smoke. I agree that it is nice to have trash cans to dispose of trash, but just like the person who carries their dog poop in a bag until it can be disposed of, smokers should have the same courtesy.

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Just Sick and Tired

9:31 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Local and state government is corrupt, our higher educational system is now best known for raping young boys, the States finances are a mess so what do politicians come up with to distract us, a favorite passtime, beat up the smoker! Tune in next month.....beat up the fat kid, let's ban McDonald wrappers in state parks, and newspapers, ban newspapers and there would be less trash and people won't realize that our politicians are incompetent except when it comes to ripping the taxpayer off.

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tamarya

11:52 pm on Monday, July 16, 2012

Okay I will add one thing here, to the ones saying throw cigarette butts in a trash can, have you never ever been taught fire safety? You do not put a cigarettw butt in with paper. You normally use what is called an ashtray or those fancy containers they use for cigarettes butts and hot ashes and will not burn. The ones that throw cigarettes butts in trash cans cause some nice fires, then you ould complain your parks burned. Give smokers the same courtesy you would like, or do not expect courtesy from us, because we will complain about everything you do. Some people do not understand treat others as you would like to be treated because they sure fail to give people respect because they smoke. Like one said, take a look around smokers are not the only litter bugs, when you find food containers and wrappers everywhere also. So you want our cigarettes banned do not eat food in the parks either because you litter food containers and food also draws wildlife.

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Angie Haas

9:27 am on Thursday, July 19, 2012

You have good points. "Give smokers the same courtesy you would like", "treat others as you would like to be treated" & "a majority of smokers do not litter". Shame you can't apply the same logic to skateboarders. You evidentally don't like being stereotyped by smoking but will stereotype skateboarders as thugs. Interesting

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tamarya

9:44 am on Thursday, July 19, 2012

How can you apply smoking to kids that will wind up hit and killed by a car eventually. And nowhere did I claim they were thugs, and apparently you have no problem with them possibly getting hit, however nyou would be bothered by my cigarette. Yup makes sense to me.

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tamarya

9:48 am on Thursday, July 19, 2012

And you don't see me arguing at meetings to take them off of the street, just don't go suing me if one rides in front of my car and gets hit.

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Angie Haas

10:07 am on Thursday, July 19, 2012

Where do you see in my comment anything about your smoking? You have the right to smoke just as they have a right to skate. I am just pointing out your hipocritical views. As for suing, again you are generalizing everyone. Not everyone is sue happy. Courtesy & respect should be shown to everyone not just ones who share your views. I would appreciate if people would stop putting labels on everyone & look at them as individuals. You smoke, I do not. I don't think you are disgusting or a litter bug, because I do not know you. You do not know all these kids. Some smokers litter, some skaters are disrepectful.

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tamarya

10:44 am on Thursday, July 19, 2012

Angie my point would be like if I did know you and was on your property with my kids and my kids were doing something where they could hurt themselves and you told them to stop. You would have every right to do that because it would affect you, the same way if I would be in an accident with those kids it would affect me, even if not sued, a highlight of my day would not be a child bouncing off my car. We are talking safety there. People complaininng about cigarettes would be like if I would complain about fireworks, I have hated those things since a child but I am not going to sit and argue them to be banned. I do not like people overloading with perfume, but I am not going to fight perfume to be banned and that basically causes sinus issues like for some a cigarette would cause. We are comparing safety to nit picking with the 2. I do agree courtesy is a fix for everything, including the cigarettes, perfume and fireworks even. However some people give no courtesy for either, but we deal with the last 2 things I stated, just not the cigarettes.

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tamarya

10:49 am on Thursday, July 19, 2012

Oh yeah and my point with the food, food draws wildlife, which can sometimes cause attacks with wildlife, now you got someone bit by wildlife plus then you have people complaining when the wildlife gets killed. However banning food from a park would be ridiculious, people usually go to a park to picnic, however it still could cause a problem.

brian

7:09 am on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

I can't believe you are trying to justify your littering by saying 1) you don't want to start a fire or, 2) everybody else litters, or 3) don't criticize smokers or we'll start criticizing things you do.

Please.

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tamarya

8:52 am on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

You are missing the point, a majority of smokers do not litter. Everyone complains about cigarette butts all over that I have yet to see. We used to live on mountain and schoeneck rd in macungie and it was amazing to see the food wrappers and containers in our front yard, never saw cigarette butts though and never caught the people throwing the stuff out. Just like you get shopping carts at the store you find either snotty tissues, grocery lists, store flyers all crumbled up in the carts. Sounds like we need to focus on littering garbage over cigarette butts. Unless I am missing these places where people litter butts all over leaving a huge mess.

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tamarya

8:53 am on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

As for starting a fire, I do what my grandmother used to do if at a place like that, have a cup with a little water in put the butts in there where they will go out then throw the cup in the garbage when done.

Kay Kreitz

10:11 am on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

Another freedom taken away. Think about it folks. What will you say when marshall law is imposed on YOU?

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sherry

7:53 pm on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

Too many bans on cigarettes. I'm not a smoker but really it is out of hand.
YES--littering is a problem, whether cigarettes or some other item discarded in parks.

As much as I dislike smoking, I don't want it banned for others.
Isn't that what America is about?.....Freedom

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Arthur

8:08 pm on Tuesday, July 17, 2012

Freedom does not mean freedom to impose on others. Smokers impose their smoke on people who do not want to breathe it. That is an action of imposition. Non-smokers are doiing nothing to the air therefore they are not imposing anything on anyone. They are simply passively breathing.

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Ann Edwards

9:55 am on Wednesday, July 18, 2012

i too am only trying to "passively breath" every time I have to be next to someone who has drenched themselves in a perfume product. It is not only an imposition, but for someome who has allergies and sinus problems is a health hazard. Lets then ban all perfume products.

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Mary Anne Looby

1:08 pm on Wednesday, July 18, 2012

Since we are going off track a little bit, I would like to share something that happened to me a few years ago. I was in the hospital for knee surgery and a number of very kind friends sent flowers. One of the bouquets contained the Asiatic Lillies that are so fragrant. After having them in the room for about 4 hours the nurse came in and asked if they could be taken home. A few of the girls at the nurses station(outside my room) could not handle the smell. Of course they went home. So if you have someone in the hospital you might want to remember not to send "fragrant flowers". As much as I love them, I would not want to make anyone sick.

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